[TagNBee]

This is a topic. I hope many more like this one are coming. If you watch my channel you will know that I walked away from the financial world and began to only invest in myself. I now invest in what I can control. I come from the finance world and I don’t want anything to do with it.

[StrongAsOak]

That’s why i asked the question here 😃. I saw your interview on Billy’s channel this spring and i was intrigued because you were in that world. It just confirmed what we suspected.

[TagNBee]

It’s a horrible game. I have zero money in the markets today

[KimC]

Personally, I believe the only things worth investing in are our spiritual condition and where we stand with God, our closest personal relationships with TRUSTWORTHY people (defined loosely as those with godly character AND competence), our knowledge and experience base, and physical assets that we have direct possession of that build our independence and self-sufficiency in this life.

There is nothing in/of this world that can/will give any of us true peace; that comes only with being in right standing with our Savior and Lord. The peace of God surpasses all human understanding. Wisdom is given freely to those who ask. Seek God for the right decisions about EVERYTHING and be led only by HIS peace. The enemy speaks in loud, urgent, pressing tones, but the Spirit of God speaks in a still, small voice.

Be blessed in Jesus’ name.

[Jeremy-aka-One-Step-Closer]

I’m from the financial world, and am working on exiting it myself. I’d really agree with Tag on this one. The best thing you can invest in is yourself. If I were in your shoes I’d see see how best to recession proof my business; how loyal is my customer base?, are there other things I can provide them? how can I attract more business? can I handle more business? Are there cost I can eliminate?

Also be sure to make sure you can estimate how much cash you have on hand. Many businesses go under because of a cash crunch.

*Obligatory note: This is not financial advice.

[StrongAsOak]

Luckily back in 2018-19 we started downsizing our business, and post pandemic, it’s just my wife and I. Very little overhead as we work on our property. We also bought about a year’s worth of inventory and supplies because of the supply chain issues, and that decision has been paying off even though it took cash up front. Many loyal and repeat customers.

All the inflation and rising costs have trimmed our margins, but we are making do. I’d say the biggest issue is that we are just burnt out. Have been for the better part of the last two years. We take smaller timeframes off, but we are excellent at what we do, so we just have continuous, steady business.

[SunshineKid-GardenCoach]

What is your business? Freesteading.com has a Marketplace in the works, maybe an option to grow your business.

[StrongAsOak]

TheGiftedOak.com – Personalized picture frames and wall signs for gifting occasions (Mothers/Fathers Day, Xmas, etc)

[SunshineKid-GardenCoach]

I checked out you website, beautiful products! They should sell great on the Freesteading marketplace. Can you do any logo signs?

[StrongAsOak]

Yes. I have a large cnc router, laser engravers, and a UV printer, so I can engrave or color print onto most any material.

[Sherri]

Since this was mentioned, I also went to your website and I Love your products! Adding to my Xmas List!!

[SunshineKid-GardenCoach]

Yes, it is going to be great to support like minded business owners!

[Summerhat-n-Chicks]

I made radical changes starting ‘17, sold my investments and my retirement insurance and put it in gold/silver . I have an uncle and cousin in finances and was suckered in like everyone else. I’m waiting for the crash since then. Currently, for me, it’s not so much as building wealth (which paying off my house would be), but more of wealth preservation, because we just don’t know where this journey ends.

[TheCannyCouple]

I feel like one of the best investments in our current situation is in education. You can never have too many books (actual PAPER) on hand in subjects that are relevant to the homestead. How to take care of your livestock with basic first aid, building compost, growing in your area, and so on. This is an area I feel like we have a good foot hold on, but right now, I have a list of books I am buying up that I feel will benefit us as things become more expensive. I am also looking at books that I can use to help give me any ideas on how to build the best property possible. If I get one good idea that is going to pan out for years, I feel like it is worth it.

[StrongAsOak]

Definitely agree to have physical books. We homeschool our four kids and have put a priority on having physical copies instead of digital, as that can always be changed.

I’ve also utilized our local library for a lot of homesteading/farming/reliance books to read thru first, and then buy the book if it’s worth having. Our library shares books from about 15 other local libraries, so there is a large selection and great way to read before buying.

[TagNBee]

I like to invest in my older years by creating infrastructure that will be friendly to a 70 year old me. It’s also lessons my dependency.

[banjoman]

Same here. I pulled out of ‘casino world’ 20 years ago. I’ve learned to put a 5 gal bucket at the end of each row I’m weeding in the garden. (It helps me get up when I finish!) Bending over or ‘down on the knees’ just don’t work so I lay down and inch worm along as I weed. If a nap attacks me – who cares. I just continue weeding when I awake. Stashing cash or metals? Some say you can’t eat metal. I can’t afford it. With the BRICS nations starting to deal in their own currencies, it’s only a matter of time when the dollar is no longer the world reserve currency. Then your cash is no good. (Devalued) What I like is to convert your cash, or at least some of it into inventory. Things you need to survive. The idea behind Bitcorn is interesting but only works if there is guaranteed electricity. Woodstove, tools, bulk food, etc. We lost our water pump this summer. We are very rural. I have a Berkey sitting above a 35 gal water tank. We were fine. It took 4 days to find the right pump without re-wiring the whole system for a different pump. I have a 325 gallon water tote also but didn’t need it. People say to turn off your main breaker to the house over the weekend. That’s the best education you’ll get as to where your weaknesses are. Carry a note pad. 🙂

[TagNBee]

Some great tips here

[Art]

Oh … how I can so relate to the “nap attacks”. I also totally agree that a notebook is a must for us older folks. Fortunately, I learned to always carry a pocket notebook all through my life for documenting all those important things. It’s interesting now to look back at what I recorded during my 20’s. 🙂

[banjoman]

I usually lose my notebook. I took off down the road the other day planning on really getting things done. Forgot the pickup! Had to walk back and get it! 🙂

[MJ-WIsconsin]

😂

[FortElswyrFarm]

“If a nap attacks me – who cares.”
🤣

[MJ-WIsconsin]

How do you get out of the market without taking such a hit on penalties?

[TagNBee]

Unfortunately you don’t. You will take a loss, as you will if it falls or is Inflated away. It’s a difficult place

[JulieDogmom]

Have you looked into rolling you IRA/401k into a self directed precious metals IRA? There are several companies that can help you do it without the hit from penalties.

[MJ-WIsconsin]

Uhm.. you can roll it over into precious metals? Without penalties??

[KimC]

I, also, am not a financial advisor and this is not financial advice, only sharing research I have done over time. Traditional 401K/IRA plans can be converted/rolled over to an IRS-approved self-directed “Survival 401K” product, which could own all kinds of physical assets including precious metals that could be held directly, if desired, or kept wherever desired. Even long-term food items, self-defense items and many other surprising things could be owned by the Plan (you just have to be willing to keep good records and balanced books with a separate bank account for the Plan).

That way a person could convert their existing soon-to-be worth less / worthless dollars into actual usable assets of tangible goods and only have to pay tax on any of them as they actually got used. No penalties for converting, just some moderate up-front set-up costs. For example, the Plan could purchase an approved emergency backup solar system and store it onsite and not have to pay any tax on the value of it till the year it gets plugged in and used for the emergency purpose. Then in that year, its value would be declared as taxable income just the same as if you cashed out that amount from your traditional 401K. At least that asset would already be onsite and available for use during crunch time without having to try and deal with cashing out funds, purchasing needed equipment, etc., during an emergency or otherwise hard times. And the benefit of purchasing when prices might be lower vs inflated or other premiums have been added. I believe the rules provide for annual testing of equipment (just not regular use), but you would need to research details as this was a while back that I found out about it.

[MJ-WIsconsin]

Wow! Great info. Thank you.

[KimC]

You’re welcome. Recommend you are cautious who you deal with and which Plan you choose. Many sound similar but really are not the same, and some claim to be okay with the IRS and might have issues or were okay till somebody messed up and then things were disallowed, etc. Others have proven track record. If you want a personal referral, send me a private, direct message. I get nothing from referring anyone.

[StrongAsOak]

Kim, i just sent you a connection request, would like more info on what you mentioned if you care to message me. Thanks!

[MJ-WIsconsin]

Thanks, I’ll have my financial contact guy look into it. I’ll get back to you if I need more information.

[SunshineMama]

Sent a request about who you went with. I’m 37 and have been looking into this. I like to do my research then bring all the facts to hubs so we can make an informed decision.

[JulieDogmom]

Yes you can. I’ve never had an IRA/401k but when things started going south in early 2020 I started looking into both financial and overall preparedness. I tried to gather information wherever I could find it because honestly, up to that point I had never really thought about it or understood how to access g/s or the markets. I was extremely behind the 8-ball and needed to catch up as much as possible. I learned about rolling your retirement investments by talking to a guy at Noble Gold Investments, but over time I’ve seen/heard others discuss it and the wife of a content creator I’ve followed for a while now became a broker for Miles Franklin and has specific knowledge in the precious metals rollover plans. You can find more here https://youtube.com/c/FinancialPrepper

I know Money Metals Exchange can help you with that too. Here’s just one of the other metals companies I’ve dealt with that has some information. https://amp.jmbullion.com/investing-guide/taxes-reporting-iras/precious-metals-ira-investing/

You can also google “IRA Precious metals rollover” to dig more into it.

I hope this helps.

[Toni]

<div>I will preface this with the obligatory, I am not a financial advisor also.
</div><div>

That said, from this homesteader’s perspective, the first thing I would think important is anything in the form of tangible assets, things you can touch, hold and own. Land we wanted to live on and be able to develop was very first for us. With no mortgage. After that, buildings, fencing, tools, other equipment, etc – things we will need to have to be able to survive whatever comes to the best of our ability.

Then livestock etc, and trees, plants, seeds, other edible items. I believe with what is coming down the pike, food and water may become more valuable than even precious metals.

The list will likely be different for each person, but I think most homesteaders would agree that owning the land under our feet is fairly high in terms of priority for attaining and maintaining wealth that will last.

</div>

[TagNBee]

As usual, well said Toni

[Toni]

Thanks Tag 🙂

[MJ-WIsconsin]

Totally agree Toni, At this point I’m not actually officially homesteading. I had 3 acres but came to the realization I couldn’t maintain it alone. I ended up buying a small house in a little town doing what little homesteading I can here. I have to admit I am missing my land but physically I know I can’t do it alone. Im actually keeping eye out for some land that I can hold too for possible future use or as an investment.

[Toni]

Hi MJ (ok to call you that?)

I think we all do the best we can with what we have, and hey, you did buy land under your house, right? I was just thinking that having things in our own possession that are useful to survive is so much more important than money or stocks , bonds, etc – things that have no intrinsic value other than that people agree they have value. What happens when they lose value – those who have them, believing they have ‘wealth’ are left with little or nothing. Much better to have tangible assets that have value regardless of the state of the financial system. If that makes sense….

[MJ-WIsconsin]

Yes MJ is fine. Yes totally agree. Tangible assets!

[Stpdsteve]

I agree, and I felt like the silver that I was stockpiling was basically worthless to me. I took almost all my silver and traded it in for sterling silverware which actually has health benefits. Now it has value to me.

[Pukalani-Farm]

And chocolate. Don’t forget chocolate 😋

[GuerrillaProvisions]

We all need to reframe our minds during this transition. I run my business tangential to the current fiat financial system and really struggled with how to let everyone know that I do not accept payment directly through the banks. It put me in a frame of mind that encouraged me to define what wealth actually means in my life. This is how I ended up communicating this to customers:

Value -> Currency -> Money -> Wealth

Value

What holds importance in your life? What has efficacy for you? I value healthy interdependence or mutually beneficial exchanges.

Currency

The rate at which anything is generally valued. A convenient way to quantify value.

Money

A stable store of value.

Wealth

At its simplest, wealth is the value that you have stored less any bondages (or debt) in your life. It is defined as prosperity and external happiness. You must first discover what you value so that you can then quantify it and store it. Remove any bondages and replace them with healthy interdependence. That is when you will truly discover wealth.

Find a quiet space and meditate on that to find your answer.

On a side note: the penalties you incur now will pale in comparison to what you incur if you wait too long.

[StrongAsOak]

Very interesting perspective GuerrillaProvisions!

[Maytag]

This is a topic I’ve been wrestling with lately, too. On one hand I don’t want to just hoard a ton of stuff, but on the other hand, my valuation of things has changed a lot in the last few years and having useful “stuff” is a lot more attractive. Ultimately, I keep coming back to the advice of the Bible to not try to hold on too tightly to the passing things of this world, but of course there is still sound sense and wisdom in being a steward of what you have and not being too careless or impulsive.

I’m in my 30s and corporate life is all I’ve lived, so thinking about how to get out of the system is daunting because I don’t have my own business to fall back on.

[GuerrillaProvisions]

There is nothing like crossing the threshold and having your back to the wall to motivate you to figure things out. When we closed our bank account and our credit cards it was quite nerve wracking, but the community that has come out of the woodworks of that wall we put our backs to have been life changing. Exiting the banking system, might not be your call to action, but I would highly recommend you answer the call that is gnawing at you.

The hardest part of not having the ability to move digital dollars online any longer is not being able to easily support people that we resonate with that are far from us, but as a result, we have been pushed to find people locally that we can support. That has been much more rewarding. 🙂

[BetterNow]

Please ignore me if I’m out of line, but what do you have to live without being out of the monetary system? And what do you really miss? I’m asking because I would like to make this step, but I would have to convince others to take the plunge with me. And even if I didn’t, I would like to know what to expect for things like “how to pay your property taxes”. TIA.

[GuerrillaProvisions]

No worries 🙂 I’m happy to share.

There is a very real practical side to taking this step.

– Analyze your statements (cc & bank). What do you spend on every month? What revolving bills do you have?

– Can you pay for those bills in person and in cash?

– For every bill that you cannot….do you absolutely need that thing?

– Do you work for someone else? Are they willing to pay you creatively? I am an independent contractor and bill in gift cards. One of my clients pays my internet bill monthly.

– What do you order regularly from online retailers? Can you get those things locally? Do they offer gift cards that you can get paid in?

– What is another way for you to store excess cash flow? Think precious metals and fast moving barterables.

I am sure that there are more things that I am not thinking about, but this is a good start to get you thinking. Once you pull the trigger, you won’t have a choice but to figure it out. The beauty of a decision like this is that you will find that the climate of today makes for a large group of people that are willing to help you with this transition because they secretly wish they were doing it too.

[Sherri]

Just out of curiosity why gift cards? I struggle to keep up with them, have been scammed with a blank card before, and over time don’t they lose value?

[Maytag]

I think it depends on the gift card. I have some prepaid restaurant gift cards that are probably over 5 years old and they’re still valid with a balance when I checked on them this summer.

[GuerrillaProvisions]

I am very specific about the gift cards that I will take and who I will accept them as payment from. It’s more of a list of needs and where I can get them.

[BetterNow]

Thank you for your generous reply. You really did get creative on some of those payment options! I would never have thought of those. Yet another reason to follow Economic Ninja’s side hustle advice.

[StrongAsOak]

Very very interesting. As an independent contractor that is operating your own business, how do you deal with taxes, submit income, expenses, keep track of receipts, etc if its off the books? Pardon my sarcasm, but this seems like an invitation for one of those 80,000 newly hired armed IRS agents to come over for an audit.

[StrongAsOak]

Sorry, hopefully that didnt sound crass or like criticism. I hate paying taxes as much as everyone else. Just wondering how you handle that side of things

[GuerrillaProvisions]

No offense taken 🙂 This will be the first year that I have simply not filed. Time will tell….I am usually a touch ahead of the curve on energetic waves that are already occurring. This has been a recurring theme in my life. 🙂 I suspect many people are not filing…and I don’t really give a whole lot of credit to the IRS enforcers news. I see it as a desperate attempt from a dying beast. If I am wrong…I will cross that bridge when I get to it.

[GuerrillaProvisions]

This is a risk that I have chosen to take. If I were to be pinched here….I am still way below the poverty line and would not owe taxes anyway. There is also a huge amount of needs assessing that has to be done when choosing to exit the banking system.

The other aspect of this discussion goes to what level of mental sovereignty are we all at on our personal journey toward freedom? I have reached a point in which I have realized that it all comes down to whether or not we have accepted an/the offer. Now that I see everything as an offer and not force….I just choose not to accept the banking offer. I weigh the pros and cons (and risk involved) with every offer and make my decisions that way.

[GuerrillaProvisions]

What I miss most and am the most liberated by at the same time is being able to send money through the web easily.

[GuerrillaProvisions]

and I never give financial advice. 🙂

[Maytag]

Thanks for the reply. There’s a lot to think about. Stopping the credit card use wouldn’t really be very disruptive to me (it’s mostly used for convenience and the rewards points, not out of necessity), but a total ejection from banking systems completely sounds pretty scary lol.

[GuerrillaProvisions]

You’re most welcome 😉

[BetterNow]

I agree, pretty scary and certain family members will lose their minds. It seems like a big problem that should be approached like other big problems: one bite at a time.

[MartHale7]

I have been asking myself these same questions.. I quit my job and started producing food. A job only gives you money, and soon food will be more valuable than money, I put 5 years of food on the shelf for the first trick, next I went off grid with electricity ( took me 10 years to do that ). Now I am ramping up food production, but not just easy food production, I am making my own fertilizer to feed the plants, and I am growing tree hay to feed chickens I don’t have yet. I have been planning this for years, and I am still learning.

Years ago I got out of debt, and then I have looked a different businesses. I have decided that I work for food. And I mean that literally, now I am growing high calorie crops that will help me feed chickens when I get them. My goal is to have 2 years of chicken food stored from the food I produce here, then buy chickens then can the chickens and have them on the shelf.

It is most important that you get right with God before embarking on any task, as the good book says those who do not lay a proper foundation are building on sand, and it will all wash away when the storm comes.

So many do not see what is coming, and is almost here…

[GuerrillaProvisions]

I think I managed to open the can of worms. 🙂 I think the main point that I wanted to make is that if you feel called to make a stand toward preserving wealth in your life….make that stand, but do it in the area that you feel called. If it wasn’t for all of the people that still have a bank account, I wouldn’t be able to work with them as a bridge to the current system when I need to.

For me….I value mutually beneficial exchange. I do not value what the banking control structure is doing to humanity. Therefore, I choose to do everything I can to not support it. However, everyone values different things. That is the beauty of the diversity of humanity. 🙂 The question is….What do I value? Not….holy crap could I really not have a bank account? 🙂

• This reply was modified 2 years, 2 months ago by  GuerrillaProvisions.

[StrongAsOak]

You are fine, it is great to have different opinions chime in, as that may also lead to ideas of our own, and things we should pursue. The status quo of our world is changing, and it may take us to think differently, to change/escape this system as you did. We are all unique, and different. What works for some, may not work for others. It’s part of what makes us all individuals, and rather than a collective (such as the clowns in charge think).

[GuerrillaProvisions]

🙂

[KristyNC2022]

I always thought this verse carried a lot of weight in the Bible but it is one I never hear any preacher talk about:

Proverbs 13:22: “A good man leaves an inheritance to his children’s children.”

[TagNBee]

I love this verse. What was God definition of inheritance?

[KristyNC2022]

Is that a trick question? First and foremost God tells us to store up treasures in heaven. This means being fruitful in the Kingdom of God and doing God’s will while on earth; telling people to repent of their sin and believe that Jesus Christ is the way, the truth, and the life and put your faith only in that. The Bible says one sows, another waters, but it is God that gives the increase.

As for physical preps, well I don’t believe in storing up silver and gold because the Bible says in the later days people will literally hate looking at it as it will have zero value. But having land, a roof over your head, food in the belly, and clean water sounds like a good inheritance to me; everything else is just an added blessing from God above.

As for finances, well, to each their own; I’m just quoting what the Bible says. It is up to each individual to pray and seek God’s guidance for what is to be done with their $$$. I know what God has told me to do and it’s not invest in this world.

[TagNBee]

Not a trick question at all. I was interested in people’s interpretation of inheritance. I would imagine that your answer is the basis for many people here. Thank you-Tag

[KristyNC2022]

It’s hard to tell sometimes how people ask a question; no worries, glad to expand on that bible verse. My answer was just the starting point.

True inheritance in God’s Kingdom is only found in Jesus Christ. That is a very deep topic but one we will not receive until death. And only then if we are born again of the spirit in Jesus Christ! Amen!

This youtube video describes our inheritance in Jesus Christ perfectly in a way I don’t think I’m getting across here 🙂

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfLu1HTnKpo

[Hippocrates_Garden]

First thought, in today’s time we have to agree or at least discuss the definition of “wealth”. With the trend in the last generation to constantly redefine words to the point it’s almost impossible to even communicate (I’m still trying to find out if red is what we use to call blue and which direction “up” is today).

Wealth = Paper money, metals, land (actual possession) or land (as written on paper, but only your’s as long as you pay annually for the privilege of calling it yours), social capital, knowledge capital, skill capital, freedom? something else?

I like what Joel Salatin says, knowledge and skills, that are in your head and hands can’t be repossessed like a car or house, and don’t take up space if you need to move.

I also firmly believe when it comes to land, it’s not the acres, but the fertility, water, and other resources which can be gleaned from it. Notice I say gleaned, not extracted or mined, as gleaning means taking the excess or surplus, usually left behind. For me it’s after nature has had it’s needs met, then I get mine, or some version where after I get mine, the land is still more abundant or fertile than before, thus reinvesting or think of it as nutrient compounding vs interest compounding.

I like the idea, often attributed to first nations, of thinking a minimum of 7 generations into the future to make today’s decisions. If the world is more nutrient and resource wealthy, how can I be poor?

[TagNBee]

This was kind of my point, what is inheritance? What is wealth? Thank you for your comment

[Hippocrates_Garden]

I guess the definition, fortunately, or unfortunately depends on the person. what it is they believe is worth leaving to their immediate heirs, or if not blood kin heirs their chosen heirs, be that the one true proven friend in life, or society at large.

I think of a time I was working as an LPN in a residential hospice facility. We had a lady admitted one day. She had at least three generations of the family present as she arrived and was settled into a room.
Eventually, and little by little they all left until it was only she in the bed. On one of my rounds, she asked me “what do I do now?” She was very clearheaded, articulate, and “present”.

As a part of her admission, I had become aware of some of her life history. She was a college professor, I don’t recall the subject.

What I offered was this. “Its my understanding that immediately after high school, you went to college, received a teaching degree, and began teaching in a public school. From there you continued your own education and advanced in your profession eventually becoming a tenured professor, correct? So it seems that your entire life has been that of a teacher.

I also noted how many family members were present when you got here, and that there were at least 3 generations, if not more here. At this time, all of their focus is on you. When present, you are the absolute center of attention. One option as I see it is, to use this time, this opportunity to do what you have always done…. teach. Whatever it is, that you see as the most important lesson(s) to pass down to the next generations, while they are actually paying attention… teach. Not what I think is important, or your bosses, colleagues, pastor or anyone else. Whatever -you- think is the most important thing (s).. teach.

[LoneWolf]

@TagNBee I have hijacked this thread, to ask you, tag, if you play a eukelele? I would pay good money to watch you play the melody to

Dirty Deeds Done Dirt Cheap, while you warble out:

Tag&Bee Life Done Free

💃🔥🏃as your lyrics. please just film Bee On Vacation, as you sing & strum. Bee IS perfect “on stage” without an instrument. BAM ⚡passive income. raise your hand here if you would pay to hear Tags Singing Voice.

[TagNBee]

If I stared singing……freesteading would be empty

[LoneWolf]

yet, who couldn’t use a laugh just now….🤔💨💨💨